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Cronulla & the Australian Right « Previous | |Next »
December 12, 2005

The race riots at Cronulla on the weekend bring the Australian Right into the foreground. The riots can be connected to what recently happened in France. I agree with Andrew Norton over at Catallaxy that the Cronulla violence is similar to the most recent Sydney riots at Macquarie Fields and Redfern. In both the French and Sydney cases the base economic issues are clear: poorly educated young people fuelled by anger, dispossession and booze/drugs, low incomes and poor job prospects, turning tribal.

LeakA8.jpg
Bill Leak

However,what happened Cronulla is also different from the events in France. Cronulla turned tribal and became racist, without the police or the political authorities fueling racism, which is what happened in France.

So how do we understand thie Cronulla riot in terms of the development of the Australian Right and in its own terms? Is it an Old or New Right?

What we can say is that more going on in this event than Tim Blair's account of beach trash, given this report, which suggests a discourse around the dominance of the white race. Glen Fuller has a stab here.

At the moment the Australian Right is a political movement possibly without a think-tank (the IPA?) and a school of thought. My judgement is that it is a political movement that provides a challenge to liberalism at the end of modernity. This political movement is pro-American, Christian, place a higher value on culture and identity than on economics, is anti-multiculturalism and very patriotic.

Can we say more than this rather conventional account of Australian conservatism and its understanding of nationalism?

Andrew Leigh over at Imagining Australia sees the significance of Cronulla in terms of 'Hindu/Muslim violence in India, and perhaps even the treatment of Jews in early-1930s Germany.' This kind of broader context is definitely needed, but it reduces the Right to ethnic racism, which is a traditional liberal response . My interpretation is that Cronulla signifies a 'radical nationalist politics' at odds with the dominant 'Western liberal internationalist ideology'.

If modernity designates the political and philosophical movement of the last three centuries of Western history, then modernity can be characterised primarily by five converging historical processes:

1. individualization, through the destruction of old forms of communal life;

2. standardization, through the adoption of standardized behavior and lifestyles;

3. desacralization, through the displacement of the religious narratives by a scientific interpretation of the world;

4. rationalization, through the domination of instrumental reason, the free market, and technical efficiency;

5. universalization, through a global extension of an (American) liberal model of society postulated implicitly as the only rational possibility and thus as superior to all other forms of life.

The tabloid media short hand of 'political correctness ' mostly refers to the politics of the New Class and so misses the sociology.

The return of a violent nationalism at Cronulla takes place within a crisis in modernity--the historical exhaustion of the great mobilizing n political narratives of right and left--- at the very point when the universalist liberal utopia is poised to become a reality under the form of liberal globalization in the 21st century. The death of the old is also the birth of the new--the beginning of postmodernity that is characterized by a series of new themes: preoccupation with ecology, concern for the quality of life, the role of tribes and of networks, revival of community, the politics of group identities, multiplication of intra- and supra-state conflicts, the return of social violence, the decline of established religions, growing opposition to social elitism, etc etc.

Cronulla signifies the role of tribes and of networks, revival of community, the politics of group identities, nationalism (Australian flags, Eureka Stockade flags, boxing kangaroos, Waltzing Matilda). The Australian Right is an Old Right not a New Right, as it stands for a return to the past, as distinct from a reworking of certain pre-modern values in a decisively postmodern dimension. It talks in terms of race not difference and this racism is the denial of ethnic difference.

Cronulla signifies a process whereby true blue Aussies mutate into One Nation Romper Stompers without becoming a National Front political movement that stills lacks a popular leader such as Le Pen in France. This movement in formation (a simulacrum of fascism?) is currently characterised by a scapegoat logic, which consists in making one group of the population (immigrants and Arab Australians) responsible for the unravelling of the social fabric, for Australia being threatened with a loss of its national identity in a globalised world.

| Posted by Gary Sauer-Thompson at 12:32 PM | | Comments (27) | TrackBacks (1)
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It was more than ethnic tensions and the troubling problem of ethnic identity in which Anglo "Aussies" reclaimed the beach, in response to the constant provocations of the very violent Lebanese gangs at the iconic surf suburb of Cronulla. Paul Sheehan ... [Read More]

 
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And Lebanese muslim gangs harassing and threatening people at the beach for years has nothing to do with it, right? God you people are morons.

And when Cronulla does not mysteriously give rise to a new pan-Australian fascist movement, what then? Will you think maybe you were wrong? Do you even bother to think about the stupid garbage you write befor you disgorge it?

iii
At the beginning of the post I did link to this post of mine on public opinion. There it is stated:

It was more than ethnic tensions and the troubling problem of ethnic identity in which Anglo "Aussies" reclaimed the beach, in response to the constant provocations of the very violent Lebanese gangs at the iconic surf suburb of Cronulla.

Calling me a moron means that you have not bothered to read the link.

As for your second criticism-- me being wrong Cronulla mysteriously giving rise to a pan new pan-Australian fascist movement--- I wrote this:

Cronulla signifies a process whereby true blue Aussies mutate into One Nation Romper Stompers without becoming a National Front political movement that stills lacks a popular leader such as Le Pen in France.

You didn't read the text closely.

If Cronulla is not One Nation Romper Stompers, then what was the racist violence at Cronulla about? Your call.

Sorry mate, can't agree. Unfortunately, the distinction is that the Muslim gang lads are the racists, not the Cronulla Anglos. The Cronulla lads don't go to Lakemba or Auburn looking to attack muslims. They stayed in their own neighbourhod and put up with years of racist invasions where the police did nothing. Also, you don't see them attacking Chinese, or Sikhs, or any other nationality. The anger is only directed at one particular ethnic group who have repeatedly provoked.

The muslim lads are in fact the real racists as they cause no trouble in their own neighbourhoods, yet venture out to predominantly 'white' ones (Cronulla, Brighton, Maroubra) and target non-muslims as victims.

Ron,
I accept what you say in terms of the Cronulla lads reclaiming their beach from the racist adn violent Lebanese Australian gangs.That is the local context, as expressed by Bruce Baird and Paul Sheehan

I'm not disputing the local context. But that context of the morning was transcended by the violence in the afternoon, which by all accounts,was directed any Arab looking person.

I'm not interested in targeting what happened as racist and leaving it at that. I reckon that is wha the liberal media will do. That doesn't make enough sense to me as it ends in a call for vigilance.

I'm trying to understand the significance of what happened in terms of One Nation nationalism that has turned violent in relation to the processes of modernity. It's a reaction against them and I want to understand as well as judge the ideas of thsi reaction.

"The base economic issues are clear: poorly educated young people fuelled by anger, dispossession and booze/drugs, low incomes and poor job prospects, turning tribal."

Are you crazy?

Cronulla, and the Shire generally, are one of the wealthiest, affluent areas of Sydney. Unemployment there is low, and it is across most of Sydney.

Your comments make sense in regard to an isolated Housing Commission area like Macquarie Fields (a scene of previous rioting), but are absolute lunacy when applied to the Shire.

I hear you are writing from Adelaide. It shows.

"I'm trying to understand the significance of what happened in terms of One Nation nationalism that has turned violent in relation to the processes of modernity."

You'll never understand the significance of what happened if you insist on trying to fit events into a pre-determined theoretical construct that is based entirely on discredited leftist ideology and has no relation to reality.

If you really want to understand what happened, listen to what the ordinary people say.

ekb87
yes I am writing from Adelaide but I am very familar with Brighton-Le-Sands, less so Cronulla.

Two points. Even affluent suburbs have a working class. Even Sydney has a working class--the working poor.

But it is an age of telecommunications we live in and the news reports tell me that the crowd in Cronulla was not just the local surfie culture claiming their beach from the violent and racist Lebanese-Australian gangs.

They inform me that a lot of the afternoon crowd came from outside Cronulla---and so it transgressed the local context. It's the transgression that I am interested in--hence the reference to One Nation nationalism.

That reference recognizes the significance of culture and not just the economic. The main body of the post is concerned with culture and the reaction against liberalism.

It could have been clearer I guess but I'm trying to work it out in terms of the One nation moverment mutuating.

Evil Pundit,
you say:

You'll never understand the significance of what happened if you insist on trying to fit events into a pre-determined theoretical construct that is based entirely on discredited leftist ideology and has no relation to reality.

Fair enough. It is a good point.

One of the accounts of the shift from modernity to postmodernity is the decline of the ild ideologies of the right and the left. They do not nake much sense any more.

Let me quote from someone from the French New Right---Alain de Benoist

The ideas of "Right" and "Left" are no longer pertinent when it is a question of describing the content of major works appearing today. As far as the realm of ideas and the work of thought go, the Left-Right paradigm seems increasingly to have been replaced by a break between the "center" and the "periphery." The former corresponds to a dominant ideology which is to legitimate the market system and the latter includes all those who, no matter what their own itinerary, challenge the axiomatic content of interest and blend of economism, productivism and utilitarianism to which liberal society has led. Fruitful dialogues are possible in this "periphery."

I agree with that account. So your criticism does not hold.

Your other point is this:

If you really want to understand what happened, listen to what the ordinary people say.

If you listen you hear racism and domination. Even Tim Blair picks that up.

I would add that you watch what people do as well as what they say as the two may be in conflict.

Gary, before the alcohol set in, and things turned nasty, there was actually quite a carnival atmosphere. Scores of houses and unit-blocks were having bbqs on the balconies and rooftops, Aussie flags draped from windows, etc. Yes, there may possibly have been white troublemaking 'outsiders' who came in to the area, but the whole carnival atmosphere (initially) had huge support within the local Shire community. If you watch the footage, you'll see middle-aged people and families with nippers and kids, drinking, chatting and hanging out in the crowds.

When the young (teens and 20-something) men turned nasty, obviously these families et al were not involved.

Trying to explain this in terms of economics just doesn't add up to ANYONE familiar with the suburb.

And as for the "explaining it within a One Nation context" line - this also has a huge flaw. Namely, that non-whites including Asians, Maoris and Pacific Islanders were present as *part* of the crowd, or just going about their normal business, and were completely ignored.

If this was about "white supremacy" or anything, they would have been targeted too, but they weren't.

It's really quite simple, Gary.
1. For a long period of time, groups of young Middle Eastern men have been intimidating and harassing locals, particularly white females, at some Sydney beaches.
2. This has led to a simmering resentment among the locals, but there had been no specific incident to galvanize any response.
3. Last week, some M.E. men bashed some lifeguards.
4. Given the strong cultural status given to lifeguards, this acted as a lightning rod to the local community and the resentment boiled over.
5. The locals turned out en masse (and yes, I admit there was a whiff of xenophobia about it all).
6. Add alcohol.
7. And the younger, more macho part of the crowd turned feral and started behaving violently, which is disappointing cause they lowered themselves to the same level as the persistent troublemakers whose provocations they felt they were responding to.

That's all there is to it, Gary.
End of story.

The perpetrators were mostly youths. Gary have you looked at spiral dynamics (Don Beck etc) and their holonic stages of development (based on research that tracks from the 60's I think) of individuals and societies? In the (red) power stage, youths with a recently formed sense of self lash out impulsively and form gangs. In the next developmental stage, a rigid, righteous code of conduct emerges with a strong (fundamentalist) view of right v's wrong and moral majority patriotism (herd mentality). This black and white, right v's wrong, shuttered thinking is clear in the comments on this post.

Spiral dynamics considers global population trends: with the average person on earth a poorly educated, impoverished teenager, and with societies becoming more nationalistic, we can expect more frequent, nationalistic power clashes with people taking justice into their own hands and traditional models of governance unable to cope.

All individuals and societies must pass through each early stage to reach a higher stage, so that process should be facilitated. Fear-based, morally posturing govts makes matters worse by keeping a society's maturity at a low level of development. It concerns me that our model of governance doesn't support broad, integrative thinking... unless more and more MP's go independent, perhaps that could help. (I have to cling to some hope)

ekb87.
I accept the carnival atmosphere of the event in the morning. See this post at junk for code.

That post also indicates how I'm not really that interested in the economics--the similarities with other events. My concern is with the differences.What makes Cronulla different?

I accept your account as a description from what happened from the perspective of the local context.But that is not the only perspective.

You can look at in in terms of conservatism characteristed as One Nation. This is a philosophy blog and so it highlights the way we think about, look at, the world; the codes that we use to make sense of, and understand, our world.

I agree with your criticism of the One Nation account:--it doesn't fit the event neatly. It really does leave too much of significance out--the nonwhites (Asians, Maoris and Pacific Islanders)-- amongst the rioters. They cannot be written out as if they did not exist.

My response to your criticism is that we can discern two strands of One Nation nationalism. One is the older white form of the Australia First Party that looks back to the early 20th century(white dominance).

The other strand the recoding or reinventing of that tradition for the new situation in postmodernity. So we have a one nation nationalism that now appeals suburban whites, Asians, Maoris and Pacific Islanders.

Cronulla highlights the way that One Nation nationalism is mutuating or changing in response to the effects of a global world.

banana,
nope I haven't read spiral dynamics but I like what you wrote there, as it introduces a fluidity into what is a very chaotic situation.

What we are seeing is the rigid, righteous code of conduct and thinking emerges with a strong (fundamentalist) view of right v's wrong and moral majority patriotism (herd mentality). This black and white, right v's wrong is being loosened up by the events of Cronulla.

The conservative account is in terms of beach trash, troublemakers, macho part of the crowd turning feral, Poor White Trash vs Poor Brown Trash. It downplays the significance of the conservative political tradition they are at home in.

That tradition lead to violence that the nation interprets as very significant and it creates a problem because it is not plausible or reasonable to justifiy the violence.

The problem is not merely as the MSM spin it, one of "racism" by white Australians. The fact is Islam carries an enormous,in built superiority complex very akin to classic racism, in the ideas of "umma", "Dar el harb", "dhimmi" and so on. These could be characterized as a kind of "socio-spiritual racism".

Indeed, given Islams' patriarchial bias, it's warped ideas of male-female sexual relations, and it's religious inclination to umma based quasi-apartheid, the behaviour of the Lebanese gangs and groups in continuously harassing and insulting non-Muslim women is par for the course.

It is Muslims who tend to act as a "tribe" far more than people with diverse culture-threads, such as comprise the average "white" person of 2005.

The plain facts are that the mix of religious and social ideas contained in mainstream Islam are simply incompatible with Western belief systems. Couple this with the exclusionary, closed world of male Islam with it's innate superiority complex ( the "dhimmi" idea) and you have all the elements of social combustion.

The liberal elite have a hard time understanding this, but the more yob-like people of Cronulla are actually going straight to the point, albeit in disgusting ways.

However these things are spun, the plain facts are that Muslim society is the one that is overwhelmingly exclusionary, that rejects modernism, let alone post-moderism, and has supremacist ideas stamped on it far deeper than the yob's tatoos on Cronulla beach.

Gary, I still disagree with what your saying, but I respect that your at least being thoughtful about it.

If I came on quite strong before, it's because I'd just a read a series of blogs/forums where people have been pontificating about it like it was some distant or historical incident. When the violence was actually happening in real time!

For example:
- a friend of mine lives on Maroubra Road where up to 100 cars were smashed, and guns were pointed at residents.
- I had driven along King George's Rd that very night and had saw a convoy of sports cars travelling at high speed, running red lights, hazard lights blaring, and beeping their horns constantly. As one beeping car swerved dangerously past me, I thought "Who are these dickheads?" And momentarily, I considered beeping back. I'm glad I didn't as news reports I read later, revealed that this convoy then travelled to Caringbah and smashed more cars, shops, as well as assaulting random Shire residents they saw on the sidewalk. And the scariest part of all - it was reported that some were caught with Glock pistols! As I said, I'm REALLY glad I didn't beep back...

Given that these reports and incidents are happening in real time, one instinctively gets hostile at what seems to be navel-gazing. I just want these criminals arrested, and arrested now.

In this web-location, that might have been an over-reaction, so sorry about that.

But I'm still deeply sceptical about your "One Nation context" train of thought! ;-)

"preoccupation with ecology, concern for the quality of life, the role of tribes and of networks, revival of community, the politics of group identities, multiplication of intra- and supra-state conflicts, the return of social violence, the decline of established religions, growing opposition to social elitism, etc etc."

Seem to remember being damned with such tortured praise about 30 years ago. Does anyone remember the 60's? There's probably enough for a book in it but everyone seems only to remember the music and the bloody hippies :)
Cronulla isn't complicated, or particularly racist (aside from John's "Children Overboard" priming the pump), it seems more like good old vigilanty militia protecting a perceived community. AKA the total inability of external groups (police, P. Garret, etc.) to maintain law and order. This was clearly aimed at all external players, even ambo's. Occam, mate.
Good post, thank you, much to chew on.

Re-reading my brief post, I should add that of course "not all" Muslims in Australia or anywhere can be stereotyped - the religion has a vast spectrum of different sects and individual believers, like any major religion. Nor can one excuse the thuggery meted out by the mobs on either side.

However, trying to explain this as a "racial" problem which is the spin being given is, I repeat, quite wrong and misleading. A large quantity of Muslims, perhaps even a majority, seem to have extreme difficulty in integrating with other faiths. Indeed they appear to either wish to dominate another faith, as the Koran tells them to, or live apart if that is not possible, as it also prescribes. If that is not possible, the Muslim is Koranically enjoined to live within and respect the majority non-Islamic laws, but have as little to do with the non-Muslims as possible. Indeed it is "daa'wa" (mission) to convert and change the majority.

This phenomenum is not restricted to Australia, but is indeed world-wide. History students will recall the dismemberment of India (founding of Pakistan) in 1946 by Muslims as perhaps the prime example of this inability to live with other faiths, in the last century.

Multicultural templates and liberalism have failed to recognise that one cannot have large numbers of people whose cultural group opposes, disdains or wishes to change fundamentally, the culture of the host or recipient country, without risking severe friction.

Integrating, if that is the word, Muslim populations into post-modern Western societies will remain a depressing challenge, to which perhaps there is no answer, for our lifetimes. Those at fault in this are not John Howard or even the Muslim Lebanese and white people of Sydney suburbs. It is the unthinking left-liberals of post 1960 to blame, who assumed that a dose of Western liberal culture would cause a counter-culture and religion (which Islam could be easily described as)hostile to liberalism, to become liberal itself.

This was a disastrous error. The solution is one that nobody can yet glimpse.

OG
You give little textual basis for your interpretation of Islam and give no recognition to the different strands or schools of Islam. You would not do that for Christianity.You would reecognize the different interpretations.

So why make Islam monolithic. Christian prejudice?

You also say that say Muslim society is the one that is overwhelmingly exclusionary, that rejects modernism--do we not have mainstream Muslims in Australia who accept the liberal modernity that is Australia?

If Muslim society refers to those in the Middle East, eg Egypt-- then you fail to make a distinction betwen a soceity based on nonfundamentalist and fundamentalist Islam.

Instead of bashing Islam why not turn your critical weapons on Australian nationalism. Is that not exclusionary and at odds with a globalised world of liberalism?

Hippy,
The tortured academic prose,

"preoccupation with ecology, concern for the quality of life, the role of tribes and of networks, revival of community, the politics of group identities, multiplication of intra- and supra-state conflicts, the return of social violence, the decline of established religions, growing opposition to social elitism, etc etc."

was meant to describe the way the shift has taken place at the end of modernity.These are markers of the end, as modernity was concerned with grand utopian narratives of capitalism and communism of left and right, the rule of experts etc,

That is sliding into the wake of history and something different is emerging--what academics call postmodernity.

PG,
are you referring to the post by Orwells_Ghost,
If so your judgement that:

not all Muslims in Australia or anywhere can be stereotyped - the religion has a vast spectrum of different sects and individual believers, like any major religion. Nor can one excuse the thuggery meted out by the mobs on either side.

is right.

Another point that undercuts your religious interpretation: a lot of Lebanese in Australia are Masonite Catholic and not Muslim. So why do you attribute Islam to them?

Your conservative interpretation now seem to be that multiculturalism and liberalism have failed to recognise that one cannot have large numbers of people whose cultural group opposes, disdains or wishes to change fundamentally, the culture of the host or recipient country, without risking severe friction.

Is that true? Are you referring to the Anglo- Saxons or Lebanese-Australians in Cronulla on Saturday.

If it is Lebanese-Australians, then how do you jump from the gangs to the mainstream Lebanese-Australian who live quietly and happily in liberal Australia?

I'm not sure why the unthinking left-liberals of post-1960 are to blame. Are you referring to the new Left or to the multiculturalists of the 1970s?

Your claim that Islam cannot be liberal is undercut by the fact that here are many Arab Australians who are liberal, accept the rights of liberalism and accept modernity.

ekb87,
there are many interpretations of Cronulla now circulating in the marketplace of ideas.

Your localist interpretation now has to compete with the nationalist Australia First Party. They say the significance of the ugly beach scenes at Cronulla as part of a movement by Australians wanting to "reclaim the agenda and say we have a culture". The racial tension in Sydney has arisen because of the failure of some migrants to successfully integrate with Australian society. They go on to talk about integration.

So I'm not the only one interpreting the Cronulla beach riots in relation to Australian nationalism.

The signs were everywhere.It is commonly accepted that an inward-looking Cronulla is monocultural--the majority of the locals are Anglo-Australians, who have a sense of ownership over their stretch of sand. Most people seem to have grown up there and many never leave and they see it it as 'our place.' The foreigners are not welcome.They can go back to there they came from--and it is not Lakemba that is meant.

The 'reclaim the beach' was expressed in terms of Australian national symbols as I pointed out on Junk for code, These included John Williamson music blaring from car stereos, a sea of Australian flags, Eureka Stockade flags boxing kangaroos, and a celebration of being a true blue Aussies.

Gary, many thanks for reply in depth. It is the same post you are referring to by Orwells_Ghost and the second was posted to correct any impression of the first that I condoned the riots or recognised Islam as a simple monolith.

You ask "Is It True" that [my] " interpretation now seem to be that multiculturalism and liberalism have failed to recognise that one cannot have large numbers of people whose cultural group opposes, disdains or wishes to change fundamentally, the culture of the host or recipient country, without risking severe friction." Yes, it's true. It refers obviously to Muslims, since the host culture of Australia is Judeo-Christian and Lebanese Christians will have no problem with that.

Yes multiculturalism has failed and is failing in most places globally, because it is a derivation, in my view, of Lenin's 'Theory of the Nationalities' and I believe it has a politico-philosophical core there. Multi-culturalism, as opposed to liberalism, is a true left-wing doctrine and like most of those, distorts.

Insofar as liberalism is concerned, there is an extent to which "tolerating intolerance" becomes a problem . You have to ask the same questions about political Islam [note the word political] in a Judeo-Christian society as you do of revolutionary socialists, Communists, revolutionary fascists, violent animal rightrs and other "illiberal" groups. How far can accomodation of their intolerance go before liberalism itself becomes a grotesque and meaningless parody?

One can play all the PC word games one likes over conservatives failing to grasp the Lebanese Christian/Islamic divide, the rich diversity of Islam, the ironies of Australian Anglo-Irish nationalism and so on.

The plain facts are that although most or even many Muslims in Australia and elsewhere may be "liberal" in their views, that is a matter of personal taste and choice ( which could change), not due to inherant liberality in mainstream Islam.

I doubt anyone can argue that core Islam is not exclusionary, supremacist, non-Judeo Christian, millinerian, non-gender balanced..... and a host of other concepts hostile to the mainstream of Western values. I can argue this but it's pretty self evident to anyone who has gone beyond Islam 101 in the 'lamestream media'.


Existentially, Islam is not capable, in it's political form and probably in any form, of co-existing with other religions without adopting either dominance form, or victim form. The primary reason may be that all other major religions seem to permit a variety of the 'parable of the coin', wheras only Islam insists ( does not even have the vocabulary in Arabic for another condition!) on the indivisibility of the theocratic state and the Muslim person.

You should better ask yourself why the Islamic country that (apart from the distortions of petro-dollar ones) has the highest index of progress and potential integrative capability with Western civilizational norms, is the one that has militantly supressed all forms of political Islamicism. Namely post Ataturk Turkey. It's not ideal, but it sure beats the alternative.

Indeed, since the riots in Australia are plainly not racial at all, as witness ( who could not have predicted it who understands Islam?) the burning of Churches last night, but existential/religious, why not vigrously insist upon the supression of all manifestations of political/jihadi/ Islam in Austrlia? The tolerant Muslims, the so-called "majority" you claim, would hardly disagree. The Lebanese Christians would certainly agree. That would leave a 10-15% "rump" of Islamic yobs who don't agree, and who would be as vigorously denounced and harassed at every level from police, to tax authorities to whatever, as Austraila Neo-Nazis and the like.

What I am saying is, regrettably, the solution to a illiberalism of the Muslim minority is the most vigorous supression of their existential ideas and actions, as is applied to "white" yobs and neo-nazis. Can this happen in a society that has adopted the idol of multiculturalism? Probably not.

Will this happen, or will the whole thing turn into a self-flagellating frenzy of European Australians blaming themselves? Probably.

Australia will probably reach the level of Europe, where strores, local authorities and organizations ban the use of Christian symbols on stores or cards at Christmas, whilst allowing jihadis to distribute snuff videos at mosques and sell copies of "Mein Kampf" in Arabic. Tolerance, you see.

the left always cries fascism when it fears the right is abt. to do something they dont like. it is the left that are & always have been the fascists since it is they who love statism. the modern right is defined imo by antistatism & capitalism. to the degree that rightists get rid of gov., their cause is just. any community whether left or right has the right to define itself racially linguistically ideologically or any other way. this is what freedom means. oz, dont be intimidated by the fascist left (there is no other left than the fascist left}

god,
It is the national security state that is statist. The national security state is currently controlled by the right.

You are equating the right with neo-liberalism (antistatism and capitalism). That interpretation ignores the national security state.

OG,
The old imperial tradtion had diffuclties recognizing the multicultural people in Australia before the 1940s--ie the Chinese, Italians and Yugoslav miners. Hence the Kalgoolie riots in the 1930s.

You write:

Yes multiculturalism has failed and is failing in most places globally, because it is a derivation, in my view, of Lenin's 'Theory of the Nationalities' and I believe it has a politico-philosophical core there. Multi-culturalism, as opposed to liberalism, is a true left-wing doctrine and like most of those, distorts.
Which multiculturalists in Australia take their bearings from Lenin? Which multiculturalists in Australia are not liberals?

This interpretation does not make sense. Multiculturalism in the 1970s was supported by members of both the Liberal and ALP party in Australia. They work within a liberal political philosophy. It did not embrace postmodernism.

It is hard to recognize what you call multiculturalism with the realities of Australia. Multiculturalism has not failed in Australia and many Muslims see Islam as a privatised reilgion and not as a jihad

What we have is a bunch of conservatives who are assimilationists and deeply opposed to multiculturalism.

yeah, well someone just knocked over my Nativity Scene and, not bein' a philospher, probably thinks it was a non-Christian. K?

hi I'm Tania and i am doing an assignment on Multiculturalism and cronulla riots i was wondering if anybody could possibly send me any information on this topic.
i would really appreciate it.
Thank you so much
Tania
My email address is baby_doll_tania@hotmail.com

Tania
type in 'conservatism' or 'multiculturalism' into the search box and you will find some posts on those topics--they would be background to Cronulla.